Yes I had a convo recently with a couple of different incels on Instagram and their thoughts on women were under a different subject (seeing women their own age and older as they were 35+) there was a deep feeling of transactionalness and a deep feeling of entitlement. They were admittedly a conservative bunch (business expert’s insta) but their consistent idea was that the main problem with women was that they were having their own lives and careers and were not interested enough in serving the men and the family. They didn't seem interested in their wives or girlfriends interests and professions at all, and I found this astounding. It was such a blanket absence understanding of women as equal people, I truly wondered what they thought was so wonderful about themselves that they believed women should give up everything for them.

And who did they expect to be with once these women gave up everything for them?

One guy was so committed to the idea that men should lead in their relationships that he told me women should teach men how to lead so they then could submit to them. It got more illogical by the minute.